Choiceology with Katy Milkman
Charles Schwab
Can we learn to make smarter choices? Listen in as host Katy Milkman--behavioral scientist, Wharton professor, and author of How to Change--shares stories of high-stakes decisions and what research reveals they can teach us. Choiceology, an original podcast from Charles Schwab, explores the lessons of behavioral economics to help you improve your judgment and change for good.
Season 1 of Choiceology was hosted by Dan Heath, bestselling author of Made to Stick and Switch.
Podcasts are for informational purposes only. This channel is not monitored by Charles Schwab. Please visit schwab.com/contactus for contact options. (0321-1S88)
A Hero's Journey: With Guests Ethan Gilsdorf, David Fajgenbaum & Kurt Gray
Luke Skywalker, Frodo Baggins, Katniss Everdeen, the main characters of many great stories, they all have one thing in common: the shape of their journey. From answering the call to adventure, to undergoing tests of character and strengths, to triumphantly returning home forever changed. It's a classic narrative structure that's inspired countless tales from ancient myths to modern media. But it's not just great for entertainment. In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at how
Rebel With a Cause: With Guests Francis Kelly & Christopher Bryan
Most parents encounter resistance from their children. Perhaps when the kids are young and turning their noses up at vegetables, or when they're teenagers and balking at curfews or dress codes.So what's the best way to encourage good choices in the face of a rebellious kid? Or a rebellious adult, for that matter?In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at the surprising ways that resistance to authority can be leveraged for positive change. During the mid 1990s, the "Truth" anti
On a High Note: With Guests Maurice Schweitzer & Matthew Polly
Do you recall the best concert you ever went to? Best trip? Best meal? Chances are good that a few memories come to mind—maybe not every detail of the event, but perhaps a couple great moments. It can go the opposite way, too. Worst travel experience. Worst date. Our memory works in snapshots of particular parts of our experience.In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at a predictable distortion in the way people remember experiences. And we’re doing it in part to honor a very
The Truth Is Out There: With Guests Tania Lombrozo & Toby Ball
Your car breaks down. Must be because you skipped an oil change last month. Or your favorite team loses. Well, that was because of a bad call by a corrupt referee. In reality, many events involve multiple contributing factors. But we tend to gravitate toward single causes. In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at our desire to explain things simply, even when the truth may be more complex.Where unidentified flying objects are concerned, there is rarely a simple answer. They'd
To Know What You Know: With Guests David Dunning & Andrew Flack
In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at the often-misunderstood and surprisingly common Dunning-Kruger effect with an interview featuring one of the researchers who first identified it, David Dunning.But we start with the story of Cecilia Jimenez, the humble Spanish grandmother and amateur landscape painter who took it upon herself to restore a fresco in her local church. The results made international headlines—and briefly made Ceclia Jimenez a household name—for all the wr
Rebel With a Cause: With Guests Francis Kelly & Christopher Bryan
Most parents encounter resistance from their children. Perhaps when the kids are young and turning their noses up at vegetables, or when they're teenagers and balking at curfews or dress codes.So what's the best way to encourage good choices in the face of a rebellious kid? Or a rebellious adult, for that matter?In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at the surprising ways that resistance to authority can be leveraged for positive change. During the mid 1990s, the "Truth" anti
To Fight Another Day: With Guests Alex Imas & Mary Stockwell
When you're facing loss—say, in a board game or during a sporting event or with a declining stock—it can be difficult to remember your true tolerance for risk. You're likely to seek risk more than you normally would.In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at a tendency to seek risk in the face of losses when those losses aren't yet finalized, but how chalking up those losses and moving on can actually help you recalibrate your appetite for risk.During the American Revolutionary
Choiceology's Guide to Better Decisions: With Guests James Korris, Carey Morewedge & Jack Soll
Over the years, Choiceology has offered a lot of advice for making better decisions. In this special episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we bring you the story of a video game that is surprisingly effective at reducing decision errors, and you'll hear about a practical checklist for improving choices in many different contexts.Solving fictitious mysteries might sound like fun and games, but the video game MISSING: The Pursuit of Terry Hughes was designed with a serious purpose in mind: to
The Charmer's Playbook: With Guests Wilfred Webster & Daniel Read
"Don't judge a book by its cover" is an old adage for a good reason. Elegant book cover designs can create a positive impression and make you more likely to judge the writing quality more positively. But these traits—cover art and writing—are separate and distinct features of books. So why do we allow the judgment of one trait to spill over to another unrelated trait? In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at a tendency to allow our judgments of one trait of a person (or produ
Recipe for Success: With Guests Simon Rogan & Michele Gelfand
Are rules made to be followed—or meant to be broken? Often, the answer will depend on culture and the context in which people make decisions. In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at how carefully people in different contexts follow social norms, rules, and procedures. We'll also see how strict and relaxed cultures affect the quality of our decisions—and how to find the sweet spot depending on your goals.Professional kitchens have historically been challenging work environmen
Take the Deal! With Guests Daniel Kahneman, Colin Camerer & Luis Green (Rebroadcast)
In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at how framing a decision based on what you stand to lose versus what you stand to gain affects your tolerance of risk.Luis Green was a contestant on the popular TV game show Deal or No Deal. The game is largely one of chance, but there are moments during play where the contestant has an option to accept a cash offer to quit. At one point in the game, Luis was offered $333,000 to simply walk away. A guaranteed win! It seems like an obviou
Top of Mind: With Guests John Farrell & Manasvini Singh
When someone asks, "What's your favorite restaurant?" odds are you're inclined to recommend a place you've eaten at recently—even if it's not really your favorite. It's just top of mind. Why do we weigh recent events so heavily? And how does this tendency impact important decisions, like whom to vote for or how to conduct medical procedures? In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at a phenomenon that can cause us to overweight recent events compared to earlier events and make
Repeat After Me: With Guests Jennifer LeMesurier & Tali Sharot
Vitamin C is a cure for the common cold. Bats are blind. Sugar makes children hyperactive.All of these statements are false. So why are they so pervasive? And why do they feel so true?In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at a phenomenon that can cause us to believe inaccurate information more than we should, and also lead us to trust reliable information less than we should.If you’re over a certain age, you might remember friends or family panicking about MSG, or monosodium
(BONUS) From What It's Like to Be … a Forensic Accountant
Curious what it would be like to walk in someone else's (work) shoes? Join New York Times bestselling author Dan Heath as he explores the world of work, one profession at a time, and interviews people who love what they do. What does a couples therapist think when a friend asks for relationship advice? What happens if a welder fails to wear safety glasses? What can get a stadium beer vendor fired? If you've ever met someone whose work you were curious about, and you had 100 nosy questions but we
A Sticky Situation: With Guests Richard Thaler, Wendy Wood & Susan Budowski
Filling out an overly complicated form or waiting on hold for hours to speak with a customer service rep is a frustrating experience. And sometimes it seems like the process itself is designed to be difficult.In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at how friction––time, distance, complexity, or anything that gets in the way of your goals—can contribute to what Nobel Prize–winning economist Richard Thaler calls "sludge." A young couple walks into a theme park and they are offer
Jumping to Conclusions: With Guests David Silbey & Ned Augenblick
A train was speeding along the tracks in 19th-century England when a passenger suddenly started smashing windows and waving a pistol in the air. People believed his actions were caused by what was, at the time, a new and unfamiliar form of transportation. Doctors posited the rattling motion and noise of trains could cause passengers to act erratically, creating the short-lived but popular myth of "railway madness."In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at how people often over
No Mean Feat: With Guests Albert Chen & Elizabeth Tipton
It’s halftime at a basketball game. A kid nervously steps onto center court. If he can score a basket from center court, he’ll take home the prize money. He tells the announcer that he plays on his elementary school team and that he has been practicing for this moment. The crowd holds their breath as the ball sails through the air, hits the backboard … and goes in. The stadium erupts in excitement. Could he be the next Michael Jordan? In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at
A Cup of Knowledge: With Guests A.J. Jacobs & Steven Sloman
Why do ocean waves move the way they do? How does a toaster work? How might ink flow through a ballpoint pen without the help of gravity? You may know the answer to these questions, but explaining them in detail could reveal an unexpected truth.In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at why people think they understand things better than they actually do.The idea started at the dinner table. One of A.J. Jacobs’ kids presented him with a seemingly simple task—thank the people wh
The Golden Misfits: With Guests Gary Lawless & Erika Kirgios
What is the difference between buying groceries for the whole week versus grabbing something to eat on the way home each day? Grouping choices together so that you make a bunch of selections all at once can seem daunting, but it can actually help you reach your goals faster.In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at how taking a bird's eye view on a series of selections can help create better results overall.Most sports teams take years to establish themselves as contenders. Bu
An Accidental Experiment: With Guests Steven Levitt, Solomon Ezra & Stephen Spector
Scientifically sound, randomized experiments can be expensive and difficult to run. But there’s an alternative: It turns out that certain real-life situations can also generate useful scientific data. The trick is finding them.In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at how events outside of our control can create opportunities for so-called natural or accidental experiments. The organizers of a heroic airlift transporting thousands of Ethiopian Jews to Israel broke the record f
The Superforecasters: With Guests Leon Panetta, Peter Bergen & Barbara Mellers
There are moments in life where it seems as though everything is riding on one important decision. If only we had a crystal ball to see the future, we could make those decisions with greater confidence. Fortune-telling aside, there are actually methods to improve our predictions—and our decisions.In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at what makes some people “superforecasters.” In 2010, the United States government had been looking for Al Qaeda leader and perpetrator of the
Survey Says: With Guests W. Joseph Campbell & Emily Oster
If you ran a survey at a science fiction convention to find out which movies were most popular with the general public, chances are good that the results would lean heavily towards sci-fi films. This skewing of data is plain to see in this context, but in many others it’s less obvious and potentially more pernicious.In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at a bias that can distort information that we gather from the world around us.First, W. Joseph Campbell tells the story of
(BONUS) From Ripple Effect: Does Diversity Training Work? with Katy Milkman
On this special bonus episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we highlight Ripple Effect, a new podcast from the Wharton School of the University of Pennsylvania. Hosted by Dan Loney, Ripple Effect showcases research by Wharton faculty and shares what their insights mean for you.As part of a series on women and work, this episode of Ripple Effect features Choiceology host and Wharton professor Katy Milkman. After years of conducting research on gender bias in the workplace, Katy has reached a
Brave on the Waves: With Guests Bianca Valenti & Katherine Coffman
We all make decisions involving risk. Decisions like trying out for your school’s chess team, speaking up when you don’t agree with your boss, or going down a double-black-diamond run at the end of a long day of skiing. So how do we determine which risks are worth taking and which ones are too … risky?In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at gender differences around confidence and uncertainty, and how we can all better calibrate our bravado.Surfing waves as tall as apartment
Fan Fictions: With Guests Hannah Sung, Crystal Tai & Anuj Shah
Finding a new favorite celebrity feels a little bit like falling in love. Perhaps you find their smile endearing, or you relate to their sense of humor. Maybe you see things in your everyday routine that remind you of them. You feel like you know them so well. But whether it’s a star athlete or a Hollywood type, the reality is they likely have no idea who you are. In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we explore how we can develop deep connections with complete strangers — and how th
The Beanie Bandwagon: With Guests Robert Cialdini & Yemisi Brookes
Mullets. Skinny jeans. Crocs. Many of us can recall trends that we've jumped on, only to see those trends become passé soon after. But the fear of missing out can snowball into heavier consequences.In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at how speculation and rapidly growing trends, however niche, can cloud people's judgment. A tight knit group of friends in Chicago start buying stuffed animals from a little-known toymaker, called Ty Warner, for their kids. The friends' enthus
The Power of Do-Overs: With Guests Jeff Ryan & Marissa Sharif
When you fail to reach a challenging goal, say, saving a certain amount of money each month or getting to the gym a certain number of times a week, it can be tempting to just give up on the plan entirely. But new research shows that building some flexibility into that plan can actually improve your chances of success.In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at how mulligans, skip days, cheat meals, and get-out-of-jail free cards are important strategies for sticking to your long
Mesmerized: With Guests Mara Rockliff & John List
It seems like every other week there's a news report about how coffee will help you live longer or will shorten your life. There are similar reports about vitamins and water consumption and any number of other health-related studies. So why do we see so much conflicting information around scientific research in the media? In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, a look at the slippery problem of separating correlation from causation.You'll hear the fascinating story of Franz Mesmer and
The Bad with the Good: With Guests Uzma Khan & Gustav Källstrand
You've probably caught yourself indulging after a workout or a game or a stretch of healthy eating. Maybe it was a pint or two after a soccer game or an extra piece of cheesecake after a vigorous hike. These indulgences are easier to justify after a healthy activity. Ironically, though, these indulgences can undo some of your hard work. So why do we tend to behave this way? In this episode of Choiceology withKaty Milkman, a look at how we justify our decisions based on previous behavior.Alfred N
Rebroadcast: Silver Linings: With Guests Annie Duke, Kassia St. Clair & Adam Grant
If you’ve ever lost a job, or been through a breakup, or failed an exam, you’ll know that the aftermath can be painful and disorienting. But for some percentage of those who experience these disappointing outcomes, unforeseen opportunities will arise.In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at the occasional upside of being forced to quit a career, or a relationship, or even a favorite route to work.Kassia St. Clair brings us the story of William Henry Perkin. As a young man in
So Much in Common: With Guests Samantha Futerman, Anaïs Bordier & Kareem Haggag
When we feel angry or excited, or happy or sad, the reasons for those emotions may seem obvious. Angry? It was that argument with a spouse. Excited? It was that promotion at work. Happy? Must've been that delicious meal. Sad? It was that tearjerker film, for sure. But it turns out that we often mistake the root causes of our feelings and other experiences.In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at a family of biases that affects the way we understand behaviors, events, and emot
How You Spend It: With Guests Joshua Fields Millburn & Cassie Mogilner Holmes
“Life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness.” A quintessentially American phrase from the Declaration of Independence. That “pursuit of happiness” takes many forms, but it turns out that some approaches are more likely to be successful, according to science. In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at a way to frame how you spend your time and money that may help you lead a happier life.Joshua Fields Millburn was hungry for success. Despite a difficult childhood, he was determi
Not by a Long Shot: With Guests Katia Jordan & Craig Fox
Humans can easily distinguish between a zero-chance event (e.g., the Washington Nationals winning the World Series in 2022) and a sure thing (e.g., the sun coming up tomorrow). But in between those two clear outcomes, it turns out that we’re not great at estimating odds.In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, a bias that affects the way we predict the likelihood of rare events.Katia Jordan had all the makings of a tennis star: a preternatural talent, an intense drive to succeed, top-ti
Fail Better: With Guests Joseph Herscher & Lauren Eskreis-Winkler
You hear it a lot in contemporary education, the tech world, and the arts: that it's important to fail, to make mistakes so that you can learn from them and get better at whatever you do. But that generally accepted wisdom is incomplete.In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at how failure can cloud your ability to learn and to improve.Joseph Herscher is creator of the wildly successful YouTube channel Joseph's Machines. He builds intricate and whimsical contraptions that perf
Under Pressure: With Guests Svetlana Savranskaya, Gary Slaughter & Modupe Akinola
If you've ever been faced with an important decision when time was scarce, information was incomplete, or tempers were running high, you'll know that it's difficult to make a good choice. Now imagine a decision that has implications for the entire world, and the people facing that decision are 500 feet below the surface of the ocean in a nuclear-armed diesel submarine that is overheating and running out of power.In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at decisions under pressur
Out of Proportion: With Guests Damon Lesmeister & Kelly Shue
Many of the decisions we make require us to compare numbers. Which car is most fuel efficient? How is a stock performing relative to the market? How risky is one medication versus another? A problem arises when we fail to make these comparisons in the right units.In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at the mistakes we make when we overweight absolute numbers and neglect their relative value.Damon Lesmeister is a wildlife biologist in Oregon who studies a very special bird: t
Choiceology's Guide to Nudges
Nudges are all around you. They might help you choose your meal at a restaurant, navigate a busy airport terminal, or start saving for the future. But nudges are often subtle, so you might not notice them until they’re pointed out. In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we’re doing things a little differently. This episode is your guide to the many ways nudges have changed the world for the better. We'll revisit examples of nudges you may recognize from previous episodes of Choiceolog
More Than a Feeling: With Guests Jamie Wall, Mona Krewel & Alex Edmans
While it’s nice to think of ourselves as rational decision-makers, more often than not, emotion plays a role in how we decide. Some people may spend more on a new car when the weather is nice. Others may take bigger risks than normal after indulging in a sweet dessert. Some may make rash choices following a disappointing end to their favorite TV series.In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at how positive or negative sentiment from one part of your life can spill over and aff
Second-Guessing First Impressions: With Guests Allen Sarven & Richard Nisbett
Don’t shoot the messenger is a metaphorical phrase for blaming the bearer of bad news. It’s easy to be angry with someone who is associated with information you don’t want to hear–say, a doctor delivering an unwelcome diagnosis, or a manager who has to fire you due to budget issues beyond her control. The phrase also points to a tendency we all have to overweight someone’s personality or disposition (that person who fired me is a jerk) and underweight the situation (sales were down this year, an
Less Is More: With Guests Ryan McFarland & Gabrielle Adams
Supply chain issues and income inequality notwithstanding, we live in an age of abundance. Our closets overflow with clothing. Many children have more toys than they could possibly enjoy. Garages are filled with sporting gear. Offices are cluttered with gadgets. And even our calendars are packed with meetings and tasks. It can all be a bit much. In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at a bias that leads us to add to our collections and to-do lists but neglect to remove unnece
A Clean Slate: With Guests John Beshears, Richard Thaler & Ray Zahab (Rebroadcast)
For many people, the start of a new year is an occasion to re-examine their lives, to set new goals and to give up old habits. Making New Year’s resolutions is something of a social ritual, but we see similar behaviors around other significant dates, as well--such as birthdays and anniversaries and the changing of seasons. And while it can be argued that all of these dates are arbitrary, studies show that they can still give you a head start in achieving your goals.In this episode of Choiceology
The Power of Negative Thinking: With Guests Annie Duke, Mike Richard & Kelvin Wu
Anticipating and planning for obstacles can sometimes be more powerful than adopting a positive mindset.A positive attitude is important when embarking on any new endeavor. However, as you may have heard in previous episodes of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, overoptimism also can blind you to important information.In this episode, we look at a strategy that can help counteract the effects of overoptimism and overconfidence. You could call it the power of negative thinking.We begin with the amazi
The Good Fight: With Guests Adam Grant & Tom Crouch
Most of us would prefer to avoid an argument at work or at home. But there are times when arguments—at least when they’re civil—can help surface important information for decision-making. In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at situations where certain types of conflict can actually lead to better outcomes.You’re probably familiar with the story of Orville and Wilbur Wright. The Wright brothers secured their place in history by achieving the world’s first sustained flight of
Expect the Unexpected: With Guests Abigail Sussman, Howie Jeon & Greg Golden
Perhaps this scenario seems familiar. Let’s say you generally do a good job of sticking to your monthly budget, but a rare opportunity arises—maybe a favorite musical artist is in town, or you’ve been invited to a friend’s 25th anniversary event—and you blow past your regular spending limit. It’s all right—you’ll just have to tighten your belt a bit next month. But then your phone stops working, and you have to buy a new model. And now your car needs an expensive repair. Again, these are not ord
What’s the Big Idea? With Guests Robert Rydell & Don Moore
When young children imagine their future lives, they’re often very optimistic. They’ll say things like “I’m going to be an astronaut!” or “When I grow up, I want to be a movie star!” These outcomes are, of course, quite rare. Most children will grow into slightly less exotic careers as adults. But even as adults, we tend toward personal optimism. We assume that we will outlive the average person, that we will remain in better health than the average person, and that our children will be above av
Not Just Another Statistic: With Guests Carol Quirke & Deborah Small
You may notice that charity campaigns tend to focus on the stories of one or two individuals or families, and that those stories are often rich with emotional content but light on information and statistics. There’s a reason for that.In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at the different ways we tend to be captivated and motivated by individuals and their stories, while on the other hand, we often become numb or disengaged when presented with large numbers or statistical info
Big Goals, Little Steps: With Guests Shannon Miller & Hal Hershfield
Most people wouldn’t attempt a marathon or a climb up Mount Everest without first working through some less audacious objectives. And yet there are countless examples of ambitious goals—new businesses, academic degrees, career changes, athletic feats—that were abandoned because they appeared too daunting in scope.In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at a simple strategy that can make your biggest goals more manageable.Shannon Miller is one of the most decorated athletes in t
Scientist Mode: With Guests Adam Grant & Luca Parmitano
Important decisions can be complex and difficult to make. We’re at the mercy of certain behavioral biases, and we often face a degree of uncertainty. And while it’s helpful to be aware of our shortcomings and mindful of our incomplete picture of the world, there is a proven way to make better decisions, on balance. In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at how questioning our basic assumptions and thinking like a scientist can help us untangle the knottiest of problems and ma
Judge the Judges: With Guests Daniel Kahneman, James Hutchinson & G.M. Pucilowski
Many episodes of this podcast deal with cognitive biases that can hinder our decision-making abilities. In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at a different kind of error: how completely irrelevant information can negatively influence our judgments, making them varied and unpredictable.This variability of human judgment—or noise—is the topic of a new book by Nobel Prize-winning economist Daniel Kahneman, with Cass Sunstein and Olivier Sibony. You’ll hear an interview with Kah
Silver Linings: With Guests Annie Duke, Kassia St. Clair & Adam Grant
If you’ve ever lost a job, or been through a breakup, or failed an exam, you’ll know that the aftermath can be painful and disorienting. But for some percentage of those who experience these disappointing outcomes, unforeseen opportunities will arise.In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at the occasional upside of being forced to quit a career, or a relationship, or even a favorite route to work.Kassia St. Clair brings us the story of William Henry Perkin. As a young man in
Hold That Thought: With Guests Sarah-Louise Miller, Warren Reed, Todd Rogers & Angela Duckworth
You probably have a list of reminders somewhere. Maybe you have a calendar with important dates marked. And likely a mental to-do list. And shopping lists. And gift ideas. And you’ve got to remember to get your taxes filed. And don’t forget to get those prescriptions filled before the drug store closes. And you’ve got to renew your insurance, and …There’s a lot of information to juggle in modern life. In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at ways to improve reminders and redu
In the Face of Risk: With Guests Jeff Elison & Ido Erev
For many, the onset of the coronavirus pandemic was terrifying. Descriptions of the outbreak in Europe and Asia led to panic buying and sheltering in place here at home. But, as time passed and people became acclimatized to life with masks and social distancing, many of those same people who were terrified at the outset began to let their guard down and take unnecessary risks.In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at a peculiar inconsistency around how we perceive risk and rar
Mindful of Mindsets: With Guests Erik Vance & Alia Crum
Have you ever visited your doctor to deal with a minor health issue and then left the office with nothing more than the doctor’s calming reassurance? Chances are good that you felt a bit better, physically, just by virtue of experiencing the environment of the clinic and anticipating some kind of improvement in your health.In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we explore how your beliefs and expectations can have a very real impact on your health and well-being.Science journalist Eri
Some Assembly Preferred: With Guests Mike Norton & Michael Ojo
Hardware stores and home improvement shows often promote do-it-yourself projects. And while it’s challenging to make your own projects look as good as the ones on TV or in glossy brochures, building something yourself can be a very rewarding experience. The trouble is, the DIY approach can sometimes cloud your perceptions of the value of your project.In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at how putting personal effort into something—be it a hand-knit scarf, a new deck, or eve
If Only …: With Guests Stirling Hart & Colin Camerer
In a past episode titled “Spoiled for Choice,” we looked at how decision-making can be hampered by our desire to avoid the painful emotion of regret. In fact, regret aversion can cause people to abandon certain decisions entirely.In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look more closely at regret itself. Stirling Hart is a professional lumberjack. He’s also a world-class lumberjack sports athlete. He has travelled the world competing against the best of the best in events such as th
I Don’t Want to Know: With Guests Amelia Boone & Emily Ho
For some people, the check engine light on their car dashboard means an immediate trip to the repair shop. But for others, it represents a nagging unpleasant feeling that’s best to be avoided. So they put it out of their mind for as long as they can. In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we examine the tendency to avoid or ignore certain information when it may be uncomfortable or inconvenient.Amelia Boone is a high achiever. Within a short time of taking up the grueling sport of obs
A Successful Failure: With Guests Cass Sunstein, Kirabo Jackson & Andrew Chaikin
You’ve probably had the annoying experience of going to a store to pick up a few things, only to leave having forgotten at least one of them. That’s likely due to the challenge of holding more than one piece of information in your working memory while you shop, not to mention the effects of time pressure, distraction, and the procedural complexity of a seemingly simple trip to a store.In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at effective tools for managing complex and time-sensi
Fair Is Fair: With Guests John Thorn & Richard Thaler
“Mom! Janey got more ice cream than me! Not fair!” For kids—and many adults—the notion of what’s fair or not often involves comparing quantities of some valuable thing. But there’s another, more nuanced concept of fairness that crops up in certain types of negotiations. In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at what people perceive as fair or not amid changing circumstances.At the turn of the 20th century, professional baseball had entered what came to be known as the dead-bal
Spoiled for Choice: With Guests Barry Schwartz & Jen Glantz
Traditional economic theory says that more choice should always be better than less. After all, if the cereal aisle has corn flakes, honey nut corn flakes, toasted coconut corn flakes, chocolate corn flakes, multi-grain flakes, and all the rest, you’ll surely be able to find the breakfast carbs that suit your taste buds perfectly. But it turns out that, in certain situations, more choices can be counterproductive.In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at how having too many op
A Bundle of Nerves: With Guests Alison Wood Brooks & Steven Osborne
The rapid heartbeat. The shaking hands. The flushed face. The symptoms of pre-performance jitters are common. For some people, nervousness before a big test or important presentation is normal and temporary. For others, it can be debilitating. Typical suggestions for managing nerves tend to involve deep breaths and calming thoughts. But what if there were a better way?In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at the science behind the state of arousal commonly referred to as stag
A Spoonful of Sugar: With Guests Ayelet Fishbach, Dan Ariely, Lynne Gauthier & Nancy Strahl
“In every job that must be done, there is an element of fun. You find the fun, and snap, the job’s a game!” So says Julie Andrews’ character in the Disney film Mary Poppins before she launches into the famous musical number “A Spoonful of Sugar.” In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at the science behind the intuitive strategy of making difficult or boring things easier by adding that “element of fun.” But while Mary Poppins was focused on making the tedious task of cleaning
Bidder Beware: With Guests Max Bazerman & Glenye Cain Oakford
Have you ever bid in a competitive auction—say, on eBay—and won the item, only to see a similar item for sale elsewhere at a lower price? If so, you may have fallen prey to the winner’s curse.In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at bias that can lead people to overpay in auctions and other types of negotiations.We begin with the story of Havre de Grace. This prize filly had an exceptionally successful career as a racehorse before being auctioned as a broodmare. Expectations
A Choice Apart: With Guests Max Bazerman & Vivienne Wagner
Have you ever purchased a car or a motorcycle or a boat, based on some particular quality it had that made you fall in love? Maybe it was candy apple red. Maybe it had sleek lines. Maybe the engine made a pleasing purr. Hopefully that decision was a happy one. But what happens when the red sports car spends most of its time in the shop? Or the sleek motorbike is hard on your back? Or the purring boat engine is a gas-guzzler?In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at how our pre
So Close to the Prize: With Guests Oleg Urminsky & Brian Zinn
If you’ve ever signed up for a frequent flyer program, chances are good that you were awarded a certain number of bonus points to start. Those bonus points feel like a nice little gift, but they also serve another purpose: to increase your motivation to participate in the program.In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we explore how your proximity to a goal can affect the way you behave.You’ll hear the fascinating story of Brian Zinn and his decade-spanning quest to unravel an elabora
Coping Amid the Crisis: With Guest Laurie Santos
An unprecedented global health crisis has overwhelmed healthcare systems, disrupted economies and financial markets, and radically altered our daily lives. And while social distancing is the responsible thing to do to slow the spread of disease, it also heightens the emotional challenges we face during these scary and uncertain times.In this special bonus episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look to the science of happiness to see how we might mitigate the adverse impacts to our mental h
The Simple Choice: With Guests Shlomo Benartzi & Eric Sink
We are inundated with decisions in the modern world. What to wear, what to buy, what to watch, where to work, what to eat, who to call, where to live, what to study, when to exercise, how much to save, etc. And every decision, no matter how small, requires mental effort. But when a particular option is suggested to us ahead of time, the cognitive load is much smaller.In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we explore the subtle power of default options.We begin with a simple experiment
Judge the Judges: With Guests Daniel Kahneman, James Hutchinson & G.M. Pucilowski
Many episodes of this podcast deal with cognitive biases that can hinder our decision-making abilities. In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at a different kind of error: how completely irrelevant information can negatively influence our judgments, making them varied and unpredictable.This variability of human judgment—or noise—is the topic of an upcoming book by Nobel Prize-winning economist Daniel Kahneman, with Cass Sunstein and Olivier Sibony. You’ll hear an interview wi
The Price of Your Vice: With Guests Dan Ariely & Dean Karlan
In an episode of the television series Seinfeld, Jerry does a standup bit where he talks about staying up too late at night. He says, “I’m Night Guy. Night Guy wants to stay up late,” to which he then replies, “What about getting up after five hours of sleep?” The answer? “That’s Morning Guy’s problem.” This illustrates a challenge that we all face: How do you stick to positive long-term goals in the face of negative short-term temptations? In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we lo
Creatures of Habit: With Guests Wendy Wood, Angela Duckworth & Stephan Kesting
Benjamin Franklin is one of the most revered figures in American history. He accomplished more in one lifetime--as a publisher, scientist, and politician--than most of us dream of. One argument for his success is that he was a creature of habit. His grueling daily schedule focused on repeating several habits of self-improvement. He hoped to achieve a perfect version of himself by automating certain positive behaviors. Whether or not he always stuck to his daily schedule of self-improvement is de
Invisible Failures: With Guests Emily Oster, Sendhil Mullainathan & Linda Rodriguez McRobbie
If you’ve toured through any old world cities, you’ve probably marveled at ancient buildings that have stood the test of time. You might think to yourself, “They sure made things to last back in those days.” And while the Notre Dame Cathedral or the Parthenon or the Tower of London may seem like proof of the superior workmanship of a bygone era, what you don’t see are all the other buildings erected during the same period that have since crumbled or been torn down.In this episode of Choiceology
Take the Deal! With Guests Daniel Kahneman, Colin Camerer & Luis Green
In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at how framing a decision based on what you stand to lose versus what you stand to gain affects your tolerance of risk.Luis Green was a contestant on the popular TV game show Deal or No Deal. The game is largely one of chance, but there are moments during play where the contestant has an option to accept a cash offer to quit. At one point in the game, Luis was offered $333,000 to simply walk away. A guaranteed win! It seems like an obviou
Your Own Advice: With Guests Angela Duckworth, Lauren Eskreis-Winkler & Mike Mangini
Say you have a colleague who is struggling to complete a project at work. You might offer them some tips and tricks based on your own experience with similar projects. And it’s reasonable to expect those tips might be helpful to your colleague. But what if it turned out that the act of giving that advice might provide a measurable benefit to you as well?In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at how giving advice can benefit the giver—as much or even more than the person receiv
Not Quite Enough: With Guests Howard Scott Warshaw, Sendhil Mullainathan & Anuj Shah
Think back to a situation where you’ve been really pressed for time. Chances are good that the pressure of a deadline or an appointment caused you to be (a) hyper-focused and efficient or (b) panicked and prone to errors.Now think of a situation where you had plenty of available time. While you were probably much less stressed, it’s also likely that the superpowers of hyper-focus didn’t come so easily.In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at how not having enough time or mone
The Lucky Loonie: With Guests Peter Jordan, Trent Evans & Don Moore
There’s something satisfying about the close door button in an elevator, especially when you’re in a rush. However, it turns out that most of those close door buttons aren’t actually connected to anything; they have no effect. So why are they there?In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we explore a quirk in the way people understand their ability to influence certain events.The 2002 Winter Olympics in Salt Lake City were a watershed moment for the Canadian men’s and women’s hockey te
Best-Laid Plans: With Guests Ken Bowersox, Robert Godwin & Bradley Staats
If you’ve ever been through a home renovation, you know that it often takes more time or more money (or both!) than the contractor’s original estimate. But why is that? Experienced contractors renovate homes all the time. And yet they still regularly face delays and cost overruns.
In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we explore a tendency people have to be overly optimistic about what they can accomplish in a set period of time—starting with a story of the phenomenon playing out on
Boxed In: With Guests Sophie Morgan, Modupe Akinola & Dolly Chugh
Assuming you live in the northern hemisphere, which would you say is colder: a day in March or a Day in April? On average, of course, March is colder than April, but there’s probably not a big difference in temperature between March 31 and April 1. If you’re like most people, though, you put March days in the colder March category and April days in the warmer April category. It’s a useful shortcut, but it doesn’t always give you the best information about the temperature on individual days.
This
Knew It All Along: With Guests Kathleen Vohs, Douglas Porch & Julian Jackson
Think about a time when something happened that just seemed meant to be. Maybe you had a feeling that your child would get into a certain college. Perhaps you just knew that your partner would forget to pack something important for your vacation. The question is, did you really know it along?
In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we explore a tendency to be overconfident in our predictions about events that have already come to pass.
We begin with the story of the fall of France. In
No Harm, No Foul? With Guests Francesca Gino & Dr. Byers “Bud” Shaw
It makes some intuitive sense to judge a decision based on its results. But is it always true that a good decision leads to a good outcome, and vice versa?
In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at a bias that can lead to errors in the way we judge our decision-making processes.
Katy brings you a story about the challenging early days of organ transplant surgery. Dr. Byers “Bud” Shaw arrived in Pittsburgh in 1981 to work under transplant pioneer Dr. Thomas Starzl. At the time,
Hitting Your Number: With Guests Jason Beck & Devin Pope
Have you ever noticed that there’s something satisfying about seeing a car’s odometer roll over from 99,999 to 100,000 miles? Or maybe more likely, looking at a clock right when it hits 12:00 on the nose? What’s so special about these moments?
In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at quirk of human behavior that can lead, in some cases, to superhuman achievement.
Katy brings you the story of Roger Bannister’s quest to break the four-minute mile—a centuries-old psychological b
Out of Focus: With Guests Dolly Chugh, Max Bazerman & Mark Pendergrast
If you’ve ever watched a TV crime drama, you’ve probably heard that eyewitness testimony is notoriously unreliable. A person commits a crime literally right in front of someone, but the witness can’t identify key characteristics of the perpetrator—or worse, gets the details wrong and implicates an innocent person. Why does this happen?
In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at the limitations of attention and perception.
The episode begins with the description of a surprising
Love the Mug You’re With: With Guests Joel Platt, Sally Sadoff & Richard Thaler
“For most things are differently valued by those who have them and by those who wish to get them; what belongs to us, and what we give away, always seems very precious to us.” –Aristotle
In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at the peculiar ways people tend to value the things they own.
The episode begins with a tour of the Sports Immortals Museum. Owner and proprietor Joel Platt claims it’s the largest and most diverse assortment of sports mementos in the world. You’ll hear
Data for the Win: With Guests Michael Kist & Cade Massey
Netflix recommendations, Amazon suggestions, Google searches, airline ticket prices, your social media feed. All of these things are driven by algorithms—computer models that crunch massive amounts of data to generate useful results. These types of online algorithms are commonplace and so, generally speaking, we’re used to them.
But what about the algorithms behind self-driving cars or airplane autopilots? What about algorithms used to predict crimes or to diagnose medical conditions? These are
The Mystery of Chance: With Guests Andy Marocco & Tom Gilovich
Have you ever seen a cloud overhead that looks very much like, say, a rabbit? Or maybe you’ve found a potato chip that had an uncanny resemblance to Elvis, or a cornflake that was almost exactly the shape of the state of Texas. What are the chances?
In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we explore curious events and mysterious patterns in order to reveal the human habit of ascribing meaning to randomness.
Andy Marocco of the Naval Air Station Fort Lauderdale Museum joins Katy to revi
A Clean Slate: With Guests John Beshears, Richard Thaler & Ray Zahab
For many people, the start of a new year is an occasion to re-examine their lives, to set new goals and to give up old habits. Making New Year’s resolutions is something of a social ritual, but we see similar behaviors around other significant dates, as well--such as birthdays and anniversaries and the changing of seasons. And while it can be argued that all of these dates are arbitrary, studies show that they can still give you a head start in achieving your goals.
In this episode of Choiceolog
Happy Holidays from Choiceology
Choiceology with Katy Milkman returns after the holidays, starting with a special New Year’s episode on January 7. In the meantime, you can listen to all of our past episodes online or in your podcast app of choice.
Choiceology is an original podcast from Charles Schwab. For more on the series, visit schwab.com/podcast.
If you enjoy the show, please leave a ⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐ rating or review on Apple Podcasts.
Important Disclosures:
All expressions of opinion are subject to change without notice in reaction
Happiness: With Guests Scott Harrison & Mike Norton
In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we examine an old insight about happiness and giving. It’s an insight that is now backed up by behavioral science.
The episode begins with a scene from the Charles Dickens classic A Christmas Carol. From there we hear from the founder and CEO of Charity: Water, Scott Harrison. When Scott turned 18, he moved to New York City and got a job as a nightclub promoter. He lived a hedonistic lifestyle that included private jets and exotic parties. He sho
Everybody’s Doing It: With Guests Tyler Hamilton & Todd Rogers
You’re an independent-minded person. You make choices for yourself based on the best information available. You own your decisions, right or wrong. Right?
No so fast. You are, in fact, a social animal. You take many visible and invisible cues on how to behave from the people around you—family, co-workers, friends, social media, even the folks in the elevator or on the bus. So your decisions and behaviors aren’t always as independent as you might think.
In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Mi
The Temptation of Now: With Guests Richard Thaler & Angela Duckworth
Most of us would like to think we make decisions for our own good. Presented with the imaginary choice between a bag of salty, greasy potato chips and a healthy salad, you might opt, in principle, for the salad. But what happens when that bag of chips is freshly opened, sitting there right in front of you? Do you change your mind?
In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we look at a bias that has an outsized influence on decisions you make in the here and now.
The show begins with an e
Losses Loom Large: With Guests Hank Haney, Dolly Chugh & Maurice Schweitzer
Winning feels good. Whether it’s nailing a tricky golf shot or landing a big client for your firm, it’s nice to come out on top. But is it the thrill of victory that pushes you to sink that 10-foot putt or compels you to put in a few extra hours at work? Or is it the fear of losing that motivates you more?
In this episode of Choiceology with Katy Milkman, we examine a bias that affects the irrational way people often react to gains and losses.
The episode begins with the heartbreaking story of R
Introducing Season 2 of Choiceology
Season 2 of Choiceology is coming soon! Dan Heath hands the reins over to new host Katy Milkman for this season. Katy brings an incredible depth of knowledge to the show through her work as a professor of Operations, Information & Decisions at The Wharton School. You’ll hear from sports stars, Nobel laureates and everyday people making life-altering choices, and Katy will share useful tools and strategies to improve decision making in your own life. Subscribe for free today on Apple Podcasts, Go
How Tomorrow Feels Today
Imagine you’ve just been through a major life event: The birth of a child. A major award. The loss of a job. A divorce. Now picture yourself 10 years in the future and try to imagine how that event affected your overall well-being. Research shows that—more often than not—your predictions will miss the mark. Why is that?
On this episode of Choiceology with Dan Heath, we examine a bias that influences the way you believe you’ll feel in the future.
The show begins with a quick survey based on the w
A Number in Mind
When you set out to buy something—a car, for example, or a laptop or some small gadget for your kitchen—you analyze the features and the style and the utility of the thing, and then you make a choice. But it turns out that there’s a psychological force that can influence what you’re willing to pay.
On this episode of Choiceology with Dan Heath, we examine a bias that affects how you perceive gains and losses, how you negotiate deals and the way you think about value.
The episode begins with lege
Swimming with Sharks
Sometimes it seems as if danger lurks around every corner. News reports of events like plane crashes and shark attacks make grave risk to life and limb feel real and imminent. And while there’s no doubt that risk is a part of life, are these the types of events we should really be concerned about?
On this episode of Choiceology with Dan Heath, we examine a bias that affects the way you perceive both risk and reward.
We trace how this bias may have helped your ancestors avoid lions lurking in the
The Devil's Advocate
In a world awash in data, you’d think it would be relatively easy to make informed, objective decisions. But there’s a problem that gets in your way, even with all of this information at your fingertips: You see what you want to see.
On this episode of Choiceology with Dan Heath, we look at the tendency to favor information that confirms pre-existing beliefs.
The episode begins in Europe in the 16th century, with a secret debate about sainthood, and then moves to a harrowing story of crime and p
Summit Fever
Imagine that you’ve put in effort toward a goal, but things haven’t quite worked out the way you hoped. Maybe your goal was more expensive than you expected; maybe it’s taking longer to reach than you thought. So the question is, do you double down and continue to work toward that increasingly difficult goal, or do you move on to something new? Do you fish or cut bait?
On this episode of Choiceology with Dan Heath, we look at how past effort, time or expense can influence the way we make decisio
The Big Impact of Small Changes
You don’t make decisions in a vacuum. Context matters, perhaps more than you think. On this episode of Choiceology with Dan Heath, we explore the subtle, sometimes hidden structures that influence your decisions. You’ll see how small changes in the way choices are presented can have a huge impact on everything from vandalism to traffic congestion to retirement savings.
Tara Austin of Ogilvy Change tells the dramatic story of how she and her team worked to reduce street crime in a London neighbo
It's Hard To Be Humble
The Battle of Midway. Saltine crackers. Carnival games. What do these seemingly unrelated things have in common? Well, they’re connected by a common psychological trap—one that affects the way we all make decisions. In this first episode of Choiceology with Dan Heath, we reveal this bias and explain how it affects decisions, big and small. Jonathan Parshall tells the dramatic story of how it influenced the course of history during a World War II battle. A ridiculous cracker-eating contest demons
Introducing Choiceology with Dan Heath
You’re not as rational as you think. In this new podcast, bestselling author Dan Heath performs forensic analysis on decision making. You’ll hear real stories, learn from top experts, and witness informal experiments that demonstrate the mistakes we too often make. Subscribe for free today to get the first episode automatically when it launches February 12.